Championing Live Music and Local Arts with Michael Hahn

Intro: Welcome to Start Local, where we talk with business owners, leaders of nonprofits, and other members of our community focused on doing business in and around Chester County, Pennsylvania. Each episode will provide insight into the local business scene and tell you about opportunities to connect with and support businesses and nonprofits in your local area.

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Liam Dempsey: Hey. Hey. Welcome to the Start Local podcast. I am Liam Dempsey, and once again, it is my pleasure to be joined in the studio with none other than Erik Gudmundson. Erik, how the heck are you today?

Erik Gudmundson: I’m doing well. I actually googled myself the other day for a security thing, and I was very happy that I wasn’t on the first page of results. I’m like, yeah, so I’m not the one and only. And I’m okay with that. I’m quite happy about that, in fact.

Liam Dempsey: That’s interesting. I think that’s the first time I’ve ever heard somebody be happy about not finding themselves. Well done, sir. Low profile. Low profile. 

Folks, today we are hoping to put somebody onto your radar. Somebody that you might want to look up in the future. We are very pleased to welcome Michael Hahn. Michael is the Executive Director of the Kennett Flash. And that’s a listening room in Kennett Square that features music, comedy, and so much more. Michael, welcome to the Start Local podcast.

Michael Hahn: Thank you so much. It’s a great pleasure to be here with y’all. 

Erik Gudmundson: Michael, I completely agree. The pleasure is ours. And I’m looking forward to getting into more detail today.

Michael Hahn: Yeah. And if people Google me, I am not a famous German singer. Though he does show up if you search for my name.

Liam Dempsey: All right, well, you hear her first. We did not have the world-famous German singer Michael Hahn. We have the locally famous Executive Director of the Kennett Flash, Michael Hahn.

Michael Hahn: There you go.

Liam Dempsey: Michael, you’ve been with the flash since 2022, and we’ve heard a lot about it in a recent conversation we had with Dave Mattek here on the show and we’ll link to that folks over on the show notes. But for folks who have not heard that yet, tell us briefly about the Kennett Flash. We shared that it’s a listening room in Kennett Square. But, you know, walk us around the venue, tell us what kind of music and other acts we can expect to see there.

Michael Hahn: Sure. So the Flash is a 100-seat music venue. It’s tables and chairs, so we call that cafe style seating, although we don’t have a cafe. But it’s, we’re host to a lot of local bands and, and, and local artists. But we have gotten quite a bit of regional bands as well as national touring acts through the Flash as well. So we, we also open up our doors for rentals and fundraisers and pretty much anything that the, you know, local community could use a professional events venue.

Erik Gudmundson: And it always surprises people to learn and/or I should say to hear the sound quality in the Flash. It’s truly phenomenal. It really does sound like you’re in a sound studio, which I think enhances the intimate feeling of experiencing a show there. How did you get such great sound? And have you ever had any bands record a live album there? I mean, it’s truly that good.

Michael Hahn: Yeah. Well, so a lot of the sound is really due to the incredible engineers that we have. So, you know, the Flash is a nonprofit, and I, as the director, am the only full-time employee. All of our audio techs are hired on a gig basis, but they’re kind of, you know, they’re very dedicated to the success of the Flash beyond that. So throughout the years, you know, as they’ve accumulated new gear or new techniques or new ideas, they’ve always kind of introduced that to the Flash. So the front of house sound has kind of evolved over the years, and really, they’re the ones responsible for making the room sound as good as it does. You know, it’s a very intimate space. It’s a shallow stage, but everything from the feedback annihilators that are kind of worked into the rack system, the types of microphones that we use, the full range monitors that we have, everything is kind of tweaked a little bit. 

And every once in a while, one of the audio techs will get a new idea or something they want to try. And I always know that it’s going to wind up sounding better after that. So really a lot of it is just them. And there’s just something special about the energy in that room. When people put that much heart into a place to keep it running and keep it running smoothly, I think that all translates into the final product.

Liam Dempsey: So we’ve seen international tours, local standup comics, some high school talent shows, and even the most recent jazz and funk fest down there at the Flash.

Erik Gudmundson: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Liam Dempsey: So what’s the most popular kind of show that you host? What brings the most people out? And then on an equal basis, what’s the most prosperous, most profitable for the organization?

Michael Hahn: Sure. Well, I think that, you know, there’s a. The great thing about the room, you know, and having essentially four weekends a month, you know, where you can program stuff, is that we can try a little bit of everything. You know, we have a lot of different genres, but I would say, you know, the most popular shows, we have tribute acts that come through. So there’s a lot of momentum for classic rock. 

And now, even getting into the 90s, tribute bands draw a lot of attention from people who I would consider not Flash regulars, you know, just audience members who are kind of picking up. And the, you know, the tribute acts, I think, are necessary to a certain extent because they really do pull the people in. They usually pull a higher ticket price, and the bands are willing to work with the venue on a percentage of the door. So that’s probably the most profitable.

But we have a lot of, I would consider legendary singer-songwriters that come through the venue, and they’re also very popular. We just tend to pay them a higher percentage of the ticket price. So, you know, Steve Forbert, Jeffrey Gaines, Ellis Paul. We just had Corey Glover from Living Color in the venue, which was phenomenal. And so they definitely are a huge draw as well. They just tend to make a little bit more than the Flash does on those nights.

Erik Gudmundson: Who sets the programming for the Flash? I’m wondering how your organization decides which musicians, artists, or acts to schedule.

Michael Hahn: Well, ultimately, it’s all me. I am the one who, if I want a band to perform there. I reach out, I send the offer sheet. I negotiate with the agents or with the band directly, and we go back and forth. I keep the calendar, along with our lead audio tech, who helps schedule all the other techs to be on their gigs. 

But we do have a pretty sizable array of agents that are used to the Flash. Right. People that we kind of go back to the,  well, too. So we have a lot of regular agents who will reach out when they have an opportunity. And I’m always grateful for that because it’s less work for me. Right. All I have to do is check the calendar and go, yeah, oh, yeah, we could definitely fit them in. That’s perfect. And bands reach out all the time. I would say most of my email, probably a good 30-40% of my emails, are new artists or bands who are looking for a place to play. So, you know, and I just go down the rabbit hole of looking at their YouTube videos and Spotify or, you know, whatever they have available to see if it’s something that I, you know, think would draw an audience or, you know, maybe, maybe get the regulars charged up about something new. 

So ultimately it’s me, but I like to think that I have a lot of help and, and a lot of, a lot of longtime agents and members, and I take recommendations from people all the time. A lot of our volunteers will say, oh, we just volunteered at this other location, and such and such played. Have you ever had them through? And I’ll write it down and reach out. And that’s how I found a lot of the new acts that we get.

Liam Dempsey: So, before we hit the record button today, we spent time chatting with you about your career in music, musical theater, and sound design and composition. And you’ve been at it for almost 20 years. And we’ll get into that in more detail in a bit. But immediately prior to leading the Kennett Flash, you were the Program Director at the Darlington Arts Center, which is in Garnet Valley. What about the opportunity with the Flash drew your attention? Tell us about that.

Michael Hahn: Oh, sure. So I moved to Kennett Square in 2013. I’m originally from Oxford. I lived in Newark and Wilmington for several years of my early adulthood. But I moved to Kennett in 2013, and at the time I was, you know, playing guitar, writing songs, performing. So I looked for open mics near me and happened to, you know, Google the Flash. So it’s kind of awesome that it was right there in my backyard. So I had been going to open mics at the Flash for years. I won the very first New Summer Sound series, which is like a Battle of the Bands series in 2018. So I actually won that contest. I got a chance to host a bunch of open mics and open for artists like Tom Hampton and Ben Arnold and people like that. So I was kind of familiar with the venue.

And, you know, working at Darlington was great. It certainly took me. I would say the Darlington Art center helped me a lot with educating me as a non-profit administrator. So I’m grateful for the five and a half years that I spent there. But I always was kind of missing that connection to music or theater or live performance. You know, it’s. I loved working with the kids and, you know, making parents happy with, you know, great arts programs and stuff. But yeah, when it was announced that the former manager was moving on, I put an application in. As soon as there was a link available, I even started calling, you know, the people that I did know who were associated with the Flash as soon as I. Before there was even an application link, because the idea of running a music venue in my hometown was like, I could do this for the rest of my life. You know, this is a dream come true. So, you know, I kind of jumped at the chance as soon as it was available, and everything just kind of worked out.

Erik Gudmundson: You mentioned the nonprofit status at the Flash. And so as a nonprofit, you have a number of revenue streams, probably like, you know, memberships and obviously ticket sales. But tell us how your funding model really works there to keep the lights on and to keep your paycheck green.

Michael Hahn: Sure. Well, it’s, you know, it’s always a struggle. We get everything from, you know, we have funding through grants and things like that from the Pennsylvania Council on the Arts. The Live Music Society has helped us out in the past with grants. So we’re constantly looking for anything that’s, you know, arts or music related in the grant world, both from PA and locally from the other great foundations. I would say that’s probably 30% of where our funding comes from.

And then the other, probably 30% is individual donations and sponsorships. Every show, I make a request that, hey, if you can throw in a little extra, you’d be surprised how far it goes. And sometimes you can collect 100 or $200 on a night just from people throwing in dollars or fives or tens. I mean, I’ve had people throw 20s and 50s in the basket, or they stop by one day and just, you know, hey, here’s a $500 check. Thank you for, you know, keeping local music going or whatever. And it’s heartwarming you know, the other 40% would probably, I would say, be the ticket sales and memberships. But, yeah, it’s a constantly shifting balance where you have to, you know, you have a different ask for every scenario.

We always look for sponsors, corporate sponsors for things like our rooftop shows, the jazz festival. We even had the Suneast Foundation sponsored one of our open mic nights. And really, you know, it was just a few hundred dollars, but, you know, I learned a long time ago there’s really no such thing as a micro grant. Right.? Every amount of money that you can raise for an organization is important. So even just knowing that we kind of had that night covered and, you know, it was a great opportunity for the Flash to produce stuff like that.

Liam Dempsey: Together with the Kennett Library and the Creamery of Kennett Square, the Flash just hosted its fifth annual Jazz and Funk Festival. And I was lucky enough to attend. And had an absolutely great time. Just the range of music, the quality of the musicianship, the quality of the sound. It was really just a blast and a very economical way to spend the weekend. I think tickets were 40, 60 bucks, something like that. You’ll correct me if I get the price wrong, but it was just a lot of value and a lot of great music. And you could tell that the bands were happy to be there.

And clearly the artists were, excuse me. The fans were very happy as well. But from your perspective as an organizer, as the host at the Flash, how did it go? What lessons do you think you and your other organizers might take forward to next year?

Michael Hahn: So every year, I think it’s worth saying that, you know, the very first year of the Kennet Jazz Fest, the Flash wasn’t involved. But we had a lot of our, you know, a lot of our friends were right. Dave Maddock, who’s the board president, was one of the three members of the Jazz festival committee. So, that first year that it went off, they did it with the Kennett Brewing Company who have always been, you know, who were always great supporters of local music. And then, you know, the second year, the Flash got involved as a place where we could host sort of a headline act, right? And then the past few years, you know, we’ve been involved as a location for multiple performances and things and wanted to get the library involved.

And I think this year especially, right. Every year, there’s a little something that we learn or a little something that we, you know, we’re like, okay, well, let’s try this. And maybe it works, and maybe it doesn’t. So this year, I think what was really important, it was probably the most successful year for the Jazz Fest. And this was the first year that we didn’t have a headliner. You know, we didn’t try to pull somebody from New York. 

You know, two years ago we had Osnoy. A year before that was Pat Bianchi, a really incredible organ player. And then last year was Orin Evans, who’s from Philly, and again, an incredibly popular jazz keyboardist. And this year we said, you know what? The bands that are around here, the bands that are local to Philly and local to Kennett and Wilmington, they’re killers, all of them. They’re so good at what they do. And there’s such a variety that we went without a headliner this year. And I think it was the most successful, you know, especially people coming around asking, well, who do I want to make sure not to miss? And you’d look at the lineup of the 11 bands, or whatever we had, and said, honestly, there’s like, everybody here is so different and so talented. You shouldn’t miss any of them and say that and mean it is a really important thing. 

This is actually the second year that we attempted to have an outdoor component to the festival too. We had vendors lined up, we had outdoor performances that were gonna happen in the parking lot. We had the Rainbow Records bus was gonna come, and they came last year, but they were gonna come again this year. And of course, the rain kind of rained us out of all of our outdoor fun cause we really want it to feel like a festival, you know, the same way that, you know, a summer fest or a brew fest has that same sort of outdoor draw and fun. 

Obviously, when you have a location like the Flash and the Library, you wanna utilize it for the performances. But, you know, we were really hopeful to get the outdoor stuff involved this year, and the weather just didn’t cooperate with us. So we’ll try again next year, I’m sure. But yeah, I think, I think the, the main thing we learned was that you really don’t need a headliner in a festival situation like that when you have as much talent as you do with, you know, Dr. B’s Groove and Sarkeesian and like all those guys that were just phenomenal.

And the big bands are always a huge draw at the library. There are folks who buy the ticket just to stay at the library all day, and they never even step foot in the Flash because they’re so into the big bands. And, you know, we’ll take it all. We had more like funk kind of funky, you know, I would say more experimental, more progressive kind of jazz stuff in the Flash this year. And I think it really worked out well. 

That’s a lot to produce. 

Erik Gudmundson: That’s a lot to produce. And I understand, you know, as the only person on paid staff, you’re doing a lot, and I’m sure you also rely on the talents of your board members. And I know a few of your board members. I know Emily Cox, Robin, Marcel Litzy, David Whitwell, you know, all great people. 

And I also knew Dennis Melton. Dennis Melton was a co-founder of the Flash and a big champion of Kennett Square in general. He was a respected local architect, and unfortunately, he passed away a few years ago. And I’m sure he would be thrilled to know that the Flash is living on and doing well. But I’d like to know, how do you recruit and retain new board members? Because that’s tough, especially when there’s a lot of load to carry there.

Michael Hahn: Yeah, well, and it’s been, you know, it’s been such a wild time in general for, well, honestly, for humanity. The past 10 years have been, you know, ridiculously full of ups and downs, but also financially, and, you know, there was a pandemic in the middle of all that, which is kind of where a lot of the outdoor stuff that the Flash does now came from, was that time period. So all that is to say that since the Flash really came into existence in 2009, there’s kind of an old guard of board members who have slowly stepped away from the Flash, as they should. Right. 

Normally, you do two or three years as a board member, and you might stick around as a consultant or something, but honestly, with all the, with everything changing as much as it did during the pandemic and after, we’ve had a lot of board members who’ve been on the board for seven, eight years. So this past year we’ve, you know, Dave, specifically the president, has done a lot of incredible work utilizing the Southern Chester County Chamber of Commerce and all his networking as a musician and an instructor to find people that really kind of fit the profile, I guess, of a solid Flash board member, but also have the willingness and the skills, the skills on their own to kind of fill in roles and gaps that are necessary on the board. And that’s really the hardest thing is, you know, you don’t really have this checklist necessarily of, okay, well, we need a lawyer and we need, you know, a marketing guy and we need a strategy guy, you know, but in a way, when you find the right person with those skills, you go, oh, you would be perfect.

So, you know, a lot of it is really just getting to know people and especially, especially starting out with people who are passionate about live music, the arts in general, and, you know, making sure that it’s accessible to as many people as possible. Because that’s really why the Flash stuck around as a non-profit, you know, is if we were a bar and corporate, you know, we wouldn’t have any money problems, but it would not be the same creature. It wouldn’t be the same animal. It wouldn’t, it wouldn’t be the same environment. 

And really, I think finding people who understand that, understand what the energy of the Flash is really about, and are committed to doing their part to evolve it and maintain it is really just about making true personal connections with people so that they understand the story of the Flash. Because once you know the story and it aligns with your sensibilities, I think people are willing to jump in, but it’s not easy to be a volunteer board member. I mean, there’s no paycheck, and you might say you only have to go to a meeting once a month. But you’re also getting emails from me about, hey, where’s the new logo design? We need more T-shirts printed up. Can I get some more posters made for free? Does anyone have any contacts who might be interested in sponsoring? You’re constantly being bombarded with, you know, me hunting for opportunities and utilizing the networks of everyone involved. So I hope that answered the question. I feel like I rattled off a bit, but…

Erik Gudmundson: No, that’s helpful. And it gives a little bit of insight, I think, into the community of what it takes to be a board member of a nonprofit that’s doing well, but is still relatively new in the grand scheme of things. And it is still, to this day, I think, a little bit of a hidden gem in Kennett Square that a lot of people know about, but it kind of feels like a music speakeasy at the same time, the way it’s sort of tucked away a little bit.

Michael Hahn: Yeah. I mean, there isn’t a month that goes by that I don’t hear from at least a handful of people. I’ve lived in Kennet for 10 years, 15 years, 20 years. I never knew you guys were here. How long have you been here? Is this just, just start a couple of years ago? Like. Nope. It’s just like the logo says, since 2009. So we get that a lot. 

And it’s. You know, I think some of it is a visibility thing. We’re always trying to get more signage, more visibility, more people talking about it. But, yeah, that’s really the biggest thing is when people start to bring friends and bring other folks out, and then they get into it, and once they realize what it’s about, again, if it’s your cup of tea, then there’s no finer place to really go and experience live music that way.

Liam Dempsey: So I touched earlier on the fact that you’ve worked in sound design and performance production for a long, long time. You’ve worked with People’s Flight Theater and a number of other highly respected local venues. I want you to tell us about what the right song or the right song effects can add to a live performance. How does that work in ways that maybe, as in the audience, we don’t really appreciate the fullness of it because we’re just kind of soaking it all in.

Michael Hahn: Sure.

Liam Dempsey: But, you know, Lend us your experience and your expertise for a few minutes here, Michael.

Michael Hahn: Sure. So, you know, coming from theater, which is where I did a lot of the sound design and composition, you know, you. It’s what I love most about theater is how collaborative it is as an art. Every designer, every crew needs to work together. I mean, lighting, you know, needs to know what sound is doing. Sound needs to know what costume is doing. Especially if you’re miking people, are they going to be wearing hats? Are they going to do this? Are they going to have that? You know, so it’s such a collaborative art. And when all of those pieces come together, it’s a great example of the, you know, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts kind of thing. 

And I have been moved to tears in theater, seeing something that had just the right score or just the right instrumentation. And it’s really a special thing. So a lot of it is working, making sure that you, first off, it starts with the director’s vision, and then you kind of want to make sure that you’re feeding that vision. But also, if you’re not composing from your heart, from yourself, and you’re not putting yourself into it, then it’s going to be, you know, more mechanical, more, you know, it’s not going to be as much art as it is, you know, just putting the ones and the zeros in place, you know, so there’s so much that goes into it being a piece of you, but also serving the greater story that’s being told. 

And in theater, that’s a difficult line to walk. And I think sometimes you have to be open to other people’s perspectives and other people’s ideas. And the same can be said about writing a song. Why does a ballad on an album hit so hard with certain people in a certain situation, but a similar song that’s written the same way, in the same key, with the same melodies or similar melodies in the same, might not hit the same. 

And it really just comes down to, I think, the heart that’s involved and how honest you are with it. So, you know, especially in a space like the Flash, when you’re talking about, you know, what feels right, what I love about the room is that our engineers do such a great job as long as the artists are also cooperative. Because you always have those artists who want to turn their amp up to 11. And, you know, sometimes in a place like the Flash, it’s too much, right? But because of the great front-of-house sound that we have, when you can hit that perfect, I can nerd out on you a little bit on a science level. So the Fletcher Munson curve is when you’re listening to something, the louder it gets, the highs and the lows get really loud. And the quieter it gets, the highs and the lows become really quiet. So the center, right, your mid-range sound is always there. And when that Fletcher Munson curve is flat, it’s about 90 decibels. And that’s kind of when you can hear the whole scope of sound from low to high.

And what I think the Flash does so well is find that point where the music feels larger than life, right? It’s in your face, and it’s got you on the edge of blowing your hair back. But it’s not too much for your ears, right? It’s not too painful. And so that sort of perfect level, and it has everything to do with how you compress the vocals, how you mix them together. Did you, you know are the bass and the kick drum operate at the same frequency? Or do they have their own space in the mix that the audience is listening to? And all of those things go into it. But, but really it becomes an art. Even though it’s all based on science, it becomes an art. And the engineers who are mixing the shows are the last members of the band, right? They’re the ones who know, oh, I’m gonna bump the guitar up a little bit because he’s about to solo or he’s the soul is about to end. So I’m going to bring the vocals back. And that dance is constantly happening. It’s never a set it and forget it kind of mentality. 

The engineer’s hands are always on the board, and especially in a space like the Flash, I think that really makes the difference between when you are truly have, you know, an incredible experience listening to live music. It’s that sort of energy. 

Erik Gudmundson: That Art and Science that you’re just describing is what keeps the audience’s attention, in my opinion, and truly makes it enjoyable. Because if they’re just listening to a wall of sound, it’s easy to tune out. In fact, your body just makes you tune out, I think. But when you can hear the highs is high, when you can hear the lows is low, and you can hear the quiet parts quietly, and you have to pay attention. You hear the loud parts that are in your face, and you’re paying attention to those too. It all works, and it provides just enough variance where we as humans can still be very, very engaged in the performance, and truly feel like they’re a part of it, you know, as they sit there and listen and take it all in and just really appreciate the experience. And that’s what I love about seeing shows that kind of flash. So thank you for articulating that so well.

Michael Hahn: Yeah. 

Erik Gudmundson: That’s fantastic.

Michael Hahn: Yeah. In theater, we always said the best compliment you can get as a sound guy in the back of the house is someone telling you that the lights were great. And it’s because they didn’t realize that it took a human being to be there so that you could hear everyone and so that the piano could come in. And you know, when you’re there mixing a live show or a musical in the back of the house, the best compliment every time. Oh, the lights were beautiful. Thank you.  I had nothing to do with it. They’re pre-programmed, but the song is not

Erik Gudmundson: In these days, when so much music and digital content is compressed as much as it can be and hard limited to 100% all the way across the board, you know, it’s not often satisfied that you find a space that’s. That’s really, you know, engineered like that. And I appreciate that. I also appreciate your answer to how much you talked about theater in general. You’re clearly a bit of a Renaissance man when it comes to just, you know, live performances as a whole.

And in a previous conversation, we spoke about an effort underway to create a single hub for the performing arts in Kennett Square. And I understand that initiative has been in the works for a few years now, but as we understand it, there has been some notable forward progress recently. So could you give us an overview of that project and bring us up to speed on the latest updates?

Michael Hahn: Sure. So the original idea, I think, for what we call the hub for arts and Culture, a lot of it started actually, you mentioned Dennis Melton, who I would say founded the Flash in its current form, made sure it was a nonprofit and something accessible for people. And he kept it going when the initial people who designed it were ready to kind of throw in the towel. 

And Dennis had a vision for this place that encapsulated more than just the live music, but the live music was kind of his specialty, but he always wanted something bigger and bolder, and so it’s kind of great that it’s continuing to live on. 

And the Hub for Arts and Culture started as a group from Westchester who helped the Uptown naur Performing Arts center kind of become what it is today. And they just, you know, they felt like Kennett Square was the right place for it. And, you know, once we kind of realized how aligned the Flash was with those ideas, they became partners, actually, I would say, before I was hired. But once I was hired, I kind of got to know a little bit more about it. 

And so a lot of things that have kind of moved forward is, you know, we had been talking with the borough in Kennett Square for a long time about finding a new space for the Flash, but also for other nonprofit arts organizations in the area. A true sort of performance space venue where parking is less of an issue, where visibility is greater, and where we really have a place where sort of the whole community can come together. 

So over the years, talking with the Borough and looking for the right spot, we kind of found this space, this annexed building in the Borough hall area on Broad Street. And it’s really sort of become a goal to get music and theater and dance and all of those things kind of under the same roof. So right now, there is actually a, there is a website that you can go to and find. I believe it’s hubforartsandculture.org, and you can take a look at some of the plans for the building. There have been architects who have been sketching plans for this, you know, the two different performance spaces that would be there. A nice little sort of community promenade where people can hang out and enjoy a drink and, you know, be outdoors. 

And so the idea is that the Flash could find a new home here with the ability to maybe put on some bigger shows, but also still have a small listening room where we can do the stuff that we’ve always done and keep that energy and that warmth of the Flash intact. 

So it’s come down to a lot of things that I would say are not my specialty, which is finding investors, finding the right people to help you back the project. But it is something that they realized that the people of Kennett Square really responded to, both in the initial Borough hall meeting where it was brought up and details were announced about it, and subsequent meetings and announcements that have gone out. People seem really excited about the idea of having sort of a home where the arts can live and thrive and sort of a dedicated space, like I said, for everything from theater to the live music that the Flash produces, Dance classes, dance performances, all sorts of stuff.

So, yeah, it continues to move forward as slow and plodding as real estate can be sometimes. But we have a lot of investors who are interested and have already, you know, verbally committed to the idea. So as things continue to, you know, solidify, you’ll see More and more announcements about it coming out as we look for, you know, people to help support, whether that’s people who want to be volunteers, people who want to spread the word, or people who have money to donate, any of that kind of stuff. You know, everybody’s kind of a supporter, whether you’re a ticket buyer or just a volunteer who’s spreading the word.

Liam Dempsey: Thank you for the update. We’ll be sure to include links for the hub for arts and culture over on our show notes page at startlocal.co. That’s startlocal.co. 

I was on Facebook the other day, Michael, and I saw a post from the Flash of you wearing a T-shirt from the KSQ Barber Lounge. And the owner of the KSQ Barber Lounge is a guy named Mark Avery. And his customers know him as “The Juice”.

Michael Hahn: Juice, yes.

Liam Dempsey: And the Juice was a guest on our show back in our pandemic focus iteration years and years and years ago. So my question is this. It’s kind of a twofold question. Is the Juice actually your barber, or were you just wearing the shirt? And on a more serious, wider level, how much of an effort do you make to shop locally? What does that mean to you? What is the value there for you?

Michael Hahn: So, yes, Juice is my barber, at first, right. It was a convenience thing cause his shop was actually in the building where the Flash was. So he was right downstairs. I was like, ” Oh, this is great. I hate having to go to the barbershop. I hate having to do this. So now it’s like, oh, and I forget he’s right there downstairs. But, yeah, he and I hit it off because he’s a. He’s a big music fan, too. He’s an incredible jazz organist. And now he’s playing the bass a lot in his. In his. In his church band and stuff. So. And. And we’re. We’re about the same age, so anytime we get together, we talk about, you know, the Michael Jordan era of basketball, as well as all the great, you know, bands from the 90s that we miss. So, yeah, I have a good time hanging out with Juice. He’s a good dude. 

And it’s definitely. It’s definitely important to me. I love Kennett Square, honestly. I mean, as a hometown, I never thought I would have a real connection to where I lived. You know, Like I said, I grew up in Oxford, and I always kind of felt like an outsider. I never was very entrenched in anything that was going on in the town, you know, when I wanted to go somewhere to hang out. I drove to New, or I went to, you know, the mall, or I did something, you know, I never really did anything in town. And I absolutely love being a part of Kennett’s, you know, culture and main drag in town there. You know, I. It’s important to me. Even on the website, you know, when I tell people how to get to the Flash or, you know, I give information about our food and our BYOB service, and I, you know, just to let them know, like, hey, we’re not a kitchen, right? We have snacks and candy. But I always recommend that they eat at La Verona, which is the restaurant that’s right next door to the Flash. I say eat there because the best part is they’ll take you to the secret entrance to the Flash, which is through the back hallway. And. Yes.

Liam Dempsey: And I did that at the Kenneth Jazz Festival. Like, can we go back in the secret way. They’re like, yes, follow us. And that was it. We got to follow him through. It was like being part of the band. It was awesome.

Michael Hahn: Yeah, it’s such a, it’s so cool. And they’re, and they’re great. They do pizzas for us just so we do have a hot food option. So they cook pizzas for us on the fly. Jack and Sam are the brothers who own that place, as you may know, and they’ve been so supportive of the Flash. And so that’s important to me.

You know, I love, I love being able to go down to Lilly’s or Mutual kind of Grill is also right behind the Flash. I’ll have a burrito for lunch there often because that place is incredible. So, yeah, I try to,  I try to keep as much as I can right in town and always encourage people that, you know, if you’re coming out to see the show or you’re coming out to the Flash and you’re not local, come out a couple hours early, spend some time walking around town. You know, go to the Mushroom Cap, go to, you know, all Filter. Right.

I always, Most meetings I ever do, I either do at Emis, the Greek place, or at Filter. So I never want to go, like out of town, to do that. As much as I love. I love the restaurants and stuff that are outside of town, too. But yeah, I like to keep it right in that. That Square Mile borough as much as I can.

Erik Gudmundson: For over a decade, every May, you undertook 30 songs in 30 days, and I’ve never heard of this 30 songs in 30 days thing before. But I understand you wrote, recorded, and published a song a day for 30 days in a row each year. How did that effort benefit your songwriting, music playing, and your recording skills? Did it make you a better musician? And are you the only person doing this, or is this, like, a worldwide phenomenon?

Michael Hahn: So, wow, okay. This could be its whole episode on its own, so I’ll try to keep it. But first of all, it was actually 31 songs in 31 days because it’s all the month of May.

Erik Gudmundson: I would have picked February and not in a leap year, for the record.

Michael Hahn: I know it didn’t have the same rhyming scheme as Song a day May, which is what I called the project. I actually had not heard of it before, but once I started doing it, I did some Google searching and I found there are some people out there who do this. So there are other people who have done it besides me. They usually just do it once and then call it quits, which is probably what I should have done. 

And I think I encouraged one or two artists. There’s a local artist named Jac Connor, Jac Connor. And he’s a young guy. I met him actually at an open mic in the Flash when he was 14. And now he’s, like, graduated college, and he’s still an incredible performer. But he did it one year, at least one year. I know he tried to do it too. It’s very intimidating. And honestly, the idea just came out of the fact that I had lost a bunch of videos on YouTube just to an error of me deleting an email and not realizing that it was associated with a YouTube account. So I lost all these videos, these live performance videos that I had recorded on of myself performing in high school and college and stuff. 

So it was always an idea, like, I’m gonna build my video channel up again. I’m just gonna do a song a day. I’ll do Song a Day in May. One song each day. And then, you know, I’ll be done. I’ll have a nice 31 new videos, and I’ll feel good about my YouTube channel again. 

And the first year that I did wound up being so cathartic and such an incredible. I mean, and the people who were closest to me only heard me complain the whole time for those 31 days. And I wasn’t doing it for anyone else. It’s not like somebody gave me an advance of cash and said, write these songs like I was just doing it and then feeling tortured by it. But I wrote some of my favorite songs doing that because you really just kind of put the pressure on yourself to be creative. But what I realized when I went to do it, So when you’re sound designing for theater, right, there’s always a deadline. And like I said, you’re always trying to make the director happy, right? You’re always trying to serve yourself, but also make them happy at the same time. And I would stress and stress and stress, and I would put it off, and I wouldn’t do it. And then all of a sudden, that deadline would show up, and they’d say, ” Hey, you know, we need that song for Act 2 by Monday so we can start rehearsing it and practicing it.

And all of a sudden, Sunday night, I would hunker down. I would play until I had an idea. It would all just come out. It would flow out of me, right? And I would be really happy with it. I was like, ” This is great. I wish I didn’t have to wait till the last minute all the time to do it. So the idea was also sort of born out of this. I’m going to face my fears of having deadlines, and I’m going to force myself to be creative and see what comes out.

And sometimes it’s really weird stuff. My favorite thing to say about Song a Day May is they won’t all be good, but they will all be songs. And that was kind of the bar I set for myself. But sure enough, by the fourth or fifth day, there was a song. There was a song that I wrote in the first year that I did it. I think it was day 10. I’m pretty sure it was the. Yeah, I should know this. But I’m pretty sure it was the 10th song. And it was such a meaningful song to me that I was tearing up while I was mixing it in my home studio. Like, oh, my God, I can’t believe I wrote this song. And it’s about this, you know, traumatic experience that I had, and this. It was so, it was such an important step for me as a songwriter that after that, I was like, I gotta take this seriously. 

And then, but I’m also a big fan of humor. I love comedy. And I. And I. And I try to have a good sense of humor about everything, especially myself. So a lot of the song, you know, I wound up doing a lot of joke songs. I would do satires of certain things. Like, I would say, okay, well, now I gotta do like a. Like a jazzy song, or now I gotta do, you know, like a song that sounds like corn. Okay, now I gotta do a song that sounds like, you know, Billy Idol or whatever, you know, so it became very formulaic in a way. But, yeah, I did it for seven years and even had some, like, through lines in the project. So, on the 28th day of every year, I wrote a song that is all part of the same story. And, you know, like. 

And then I also wrote songs about, like, having an angel and a demon on your shoulder and the things that they argue about. And sure enough, by the seventh year, they were both on the same team arguing at me. So it was like. It was like those songs evolved and kind of had the story of their own. So I made a whole playlist on YouTube that’s just those songs in chronological order. So, yeah, it was. I mean, it was wild. I wrote some stuff that’s really meaningful to me and that I still play to this day. I play them at the Flash Open mics I’m talking to Dave Matic right now about recording five or six of them as an EP, just so I don’t have to do that work. I want somebody else’s perspective. 

But, yeah, it really. Just to answer the last part of your question, it did kind of take my songwriting and I would say recording to a new level. I think I got comfortable again. And then it, you know, it became very formulaic. Here’s the compressor that I always use on my voice, and here’s the effects that I always use. But then once I realized I was doing that, I started trying other stuff, and so more weird stuff came out. Well, I’m gonna try this with real drums. I’m gonna try this with some effects on my guitar that I’ve never listened to before, or I’ve never tried. So it kind of, I got stuck again. But then that helped push me forward because I didn’t want to be stuck. That was the whole point, was to try new stuff. And, yeah, I would say, for the most part, I’m really happy with almost all of those 231 songs or whatever it is for seven years.

Liam Dempsey: Yeah, that sounds like quite a journey. Quite a journey. And I love forcing yourself to be creative and forcing yourself. Well, realizing that maybe not in a rut. That’s not a great way to say it, but you’re getting more formulaic than you want to be, and so you deliberately get into a different lane or set up some kind of auditory change of pace. I like that. I like that a lot.

Michael Hahn: So I’m a big fan of Stephen King, as I’m one of the constant readers of Stephen King. So I really love his Dark Tower series and the Fact that a lot of his books all tie back into that Dark Tower series. And he’s got this thing he refers to as the different levels of the tower being these different realities. And sometimes there’s a song like “Hey, Jude” that exists in every reality because someone in a different reality got some of that energy and wrote the song themselves. But maybe the lyrics are a little different. So I’ve always been a big fan of that idea that, like, sometimes music and art and creativity, you don’t know where it comes from. And that’s why sometimes it’s like when you sit down, and you force yourself into this state of, I’m gonna write or die, and you just, I’m gonna be creative. Sometimes those floodgates open up and you’re like, I don’t know where that riff came from. I don’t know where those lyrics came from, but I love them. I’m not even sure what this song means, but those are the words that came in my head when I wrote the song. 

And it feels like one of those moments, like you’re tapping into something from another reality that someone else wrote, and you’re just kind of being a siphon for it, you know? And so I loved that idea that that’s what was happening on the songs that I really like in Song A Day May. That’s what was happening. And I think of the ones that I don’t like, I was probably just exhausted.

Liam Dempsey: Yeah, I respect that. I respect that. When we spoke to Dave Matic, he came up yet again here. In our conversation today, but with Dave, we talked a lot about being a working musician and the effort and creativity that individuals need to really make making a career in music work be a possibility. You also work in music and performing arts, and, you know, it’s different than Dave’s career. But what advice would you give to young people exploring a career in music or the performing arts in really whatever capacity?

Michael Hahn: Oh, wow. You know, I think the most important thing, and this might sound facetious or like I’m making a joke, but really, don’t be a jerk. That is the best advice I could give anybody. Whether you want to be a sound guy who’s live mixing, or you want to be a guitarist in a band, or you want to be the keyboardist who plays three hours a night in the restaurant, and make money.

One of the most important things you can be is a kind, empathetic human being. Because people want to work. It’s easier to get work, and it’s easier to network when you are right. Somebody who can get along with everybody. And it doesn’t mean don’t stand up for yourself. You definitely have to walk that line. It doesn’t mean let someone underpay you or anything like that. But I definitely think it’s really important to kind of meet everybody where they are and just be kind and compassionate and willing to see their points of view or perspectives and just…

But also, you know, be dedicated to that craft, you know, if you want to play guitar. I see these guys come on stage in the Flash, and they’re 25, 26 years. You know, they’re 20 years younger than me, and they play guitar four times as good as I could. And I’m like, I’ve been playing guitar for 36 years. I should be way better than I am. And a lot of it is because I don’t necessarily practice every day. You know, I do it because I enjoy it. But if you really. If you really want to explore something, be dedicated to it. Right? Put those hours in and practice. Because the guys who go on to be studio musicians, you know, they may never be, you know, Dave Grohl or, you know, a famous frontman or somebody in a band, but they make a living playing music. And if you know, if that’s really what you want to do, just be dedicated to your craft and don’t be a jerk.

And it’s. And, you know, continue to network, you know, as best you can. I know, you know, different people have different levels of humanity that they can, you know, tolerate. And I get that sometimes you’re an anxious person when you deal with other people, but if you can network and, you know, aand people know you’re a good person, they say, oh, yeah, he can play guitar, but you know what? He’s the nicest guy, and you definitely want him on this next project of yours. That’s how you get your next gig. And that’s how I got all my gigs in theater, was that directors say, oh, you know, who was really good to work with, should work with Mike. Yeah.

And they don’t know that behind the scenes, I’m stressing out because I never wrote that song they asked me to write until the day before. But that was my own issues that I had to deal with. So, yeah, just, you know, just work. Work hard and be kind to yourself, but also be kind to everyone you can possibly be kind to.

Erik Gudmundson: Well, now that we know a lot more about you and a lot more about the ways you appreciate music and performers in general, tell us about some of the artists that you’re focused on right now. Maybe one or two in the interest of time.

Michael Hahn: Oh, sure. Well, locally or sort of famously or anything.

Erik Gudmundson: Whatever you want. Maybe one local, one not local.

Michael Hahn: Sure. So local artist, Strays & Misfits. This is a husband and wife duo named Lou and Magda. And they make folk. That’s the easiest way I can describe it, but they make the kind of folk that Lou is a punk rock kid that never grew up. And Magda is a Polish gospel singer. 

And let me tell you, it is incredible music. She is an incredible songwriter. She has a powerful voice. Lou is a multi-instrumentalist who’s deaf in one ear and mixed their whole first album. And it sounds great. I’m like, I went to school for this. People like you make me so infuriated. But they’re, again, they’re just. They’re good people. They have huge hearts, and they write some of the most beautiful music. They write music about all manner of human conditions. So Strays & Misfits is somebody that regularly comes back to the Flash. They have done things for us at low to no cost because they believe in the Flash.

And again, they’re just, they’re always willing to help out and support, but they also make incredible music. So I’m always trying to get them heard by somebody because they’re one of those duos that if the right person heard them, they would be famous. That’s how good their music is. 

And I would say a more popular artist who’s actually been to the Flash a couple of times that I’m really into is Buffalo Nichols. He is a young bluesman, and I would say that he plays a lot. He plays a lot of old blues style and techniques, but his songs are very modern. He incorporates electronic drums sometimes in them, and synthesizers. So it’s really almost this, like, blues, neo soul, just incredible AmErikana music.

I think he is one of the most underrated blues artists that are out there today. His first album was a kind of a huge hit because he did a lot of, I would say, straight ahead blues. And then his second album was a little more experimental, and I enjoyed it a lot. But I’m very anxious to hear whatever he comes up with for his third album because some of the videos of him playing live is wild. 

He’s the equivalent of when you take a heavy metal guitarist, somebody with those chops, like Nuno Bettencourt, or somebody from the 80s hair metal days, take somebody with those chops and then put a slide on his hand or put him in the blues world. He is A phenomenal musician and a really great songwriter.

Liam Dempsey: Well, for the audience listening, I’ll repeat their names. Strays & Misfits is our local band that Lou and Magda playing some kind of folk music, and Buffalo Nichols Blues focused and we will link to both of their music over on startlocal.co. 

I know you said that you’re the only full-time employee at the Kennett Flash, but two questions for you. I expect you’re always looking for volunteers. Tell us a little bit about how folks interested can get involved in that. But also, are you hiring? Are you looking for anybody else? Any other assistance?

Michael Hahn: Gotcha. Well, at the moment, the easy answer is no, we are not hiring. And that’s again simply a budget thing. We’re always trying to keep the lights on and keep everyone paid from the artists to the director. So, at the moment, the budget does not account for hiring anyone new. Even though I have people ask all the time, I wish I could help them all out.

We do often though have room usually for audio engineers like people who want to, because that’s always just a per-gig basis. That’s a contractor or a W9 contractor kind of situation. But as far as volunteering at the Flash, the easiest thing to do is to email me, or even if you reach out on the Flash, Instagram or Facebook, because what we typically do is just the first. We’ll set you up with a night where you can shadow an experienced volunteer because most of the time, what we do is front of house stuff, taking tickets, selling the BYOB fee, handing out glasses or selling concessions behind the concessions counter. 

So it’s just a little bit of training involved in understanding the point of sale system and sort of the process. But honestly, the busy period is when the doors open. Once the show starts, you usually just get to kind of hang back and watch a great show for free. So yeah, we stick you with an experienced volunteer for your first time, and then after that, we have a sign-up page where you go, and you look at the calendar, and if there’s an open spot and you’re available, you just sign up for it. So it’s a great opportunity for people who love music or teens, if they need volunteer hours for graduating or anything like that. It’s a good time.

Erik Gudmundson: The Kennett Flash is a really important part of the community. But Michael, if you would tell us about a local business or nonprofit also in the community that more folks should know about.

Michael Hahn: There’s a group from Wilmington that runs the Koh show live. And Koh show is K-O-H is Mike Koh is the head of it, and Koh show is basically something that he does from his home studio. They promote local original artists. They film high-quality live video of the artists performing and they also record the artists performing. 

And they do a couple of seasons every year. And it’s really an incredible thing. I don’t think anybody gets paid for it. You know, they do some fundraisers to help pay for gear and things like that. But it’s some of the folks from Rainbow Records in Newark are part of the crew.

And like I said, Mike Koh, who owns Smalls Music Shop in Wilmington. But Koh Show live is something that when their season is going, it’s every Monday at 8, and you can tune in on YouTube. It’s probably the easiest place. 

And then you can also see all the previous shows that they’ve done there. That’s really something that I wish. When Mike Koh started doing it, I went, oh man, I wish the Flash had done that. So it’s just one of those cool things. It just takes original live, local bands and gives them a platform and some great live recordings too to have.  So that’s somebody that I think especially live music fans should know more about.

Erik Gudmundson: Michael Hahn, Executive Director at the Kennet Flash, where can listeners connect with you? Learn more about the Kennett Flash, maybe find out how to become a sponsor of the Kennett Flash and see what’s on in the coming weeks.

Michael Hahn: Sure. The best place is the website kennettflash.org Kennett is two N’s and two T’s, and you can go on there and find all the information about the venue. There’s also connections to our social media, so we have a Facebook and an Instagram that you can follow as well. 

And you know, that’s really the easiest way we get our information out is social media and the website. And so yeah, definitely come take a look at all the great shows that we have coming up. We have outdoor shows coming back this summer. We have a lot. We have our Battle of the Bands. The new Summer Sound series is starting up in a couple of weeks, and a lot of other stuff in between. 

So there’s always something for someone, I think at the Flash, and I’m a pretty big proponent that no matter what it is, it’s gonna be good. Even if it’s a genre that maybe you’re not used to. We really try to vet our artists to be just high quality, engaging, or something new and exciting. So I think there’s always a good opportunity to see something either incredible or new, and exciting at the Flash.

Liam Dempsey: Well, you’ve got me, Michael. Very excited to come back down to the Flash and see another show before too long. Thanks so much for joining us today.

Michael Hahn: Absolutely. Thanks for having me. Hope to see you soon.

Erik Gudmundson: Yeah. Michael, thank you so much for coming on. And thank you also to my co-host, Liam Dempsey. I’m Erik Gudmundson.

The Start Local podcast is published every two weeks. We invite you to subscribe to Start Local using your favorite podcast app or ask your smart speaker to play the Start Local podcast. You can visit the Start Local website that Leah mentioned earlier at startlocal.co for show notes, including links mentioned on this show and summaries of past episodes. We hope you can join us for the next episode.

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